Epstein Files Flop, State of the Market, Autonomous Robots, Trump's Gold Card, Friedberg on Jeopardy

all right everybody welcome back to the all-in podcast our incredible comedian celebrity guest got sick at the last minute today and didn't make it we won't say who it is but my Lord when he comes on this show you are going to laugh your ass off because he's awesome I like the comedians I think that their takes on society and culture are pretty interesting I think do you think it will work in our format what's your prediction here we've never done it I think the quality of the show is best when it's less just people doing takes and it's more the back and forth banter so yeah that's what I'm always trying to do is get the ball to go around the horn and get some real dialogue going here but uh you know sometimes people feel passionate with me again this week on the all-in podcast David freeberg and shth poopaa my name is Jason cakenis you can follow me on x.com Jason he's choth and he's why why can't I why can't I make fun of you in the replies on Twitter anymore oh because AB apply to you no what I did was my replies were so many Maga lunatics and crypto scams that I had no choice but to like I had to do something because I would have like 500 replies to every single one and I put it on subscription and I said if you want a reply it's $3 a month now 1,500 lunatics signed up so I did I did so I could troll it just so you can troll me and I thank you for the $3 every month it's all going to char let your winners ride Rainman David and instead we open source it to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it love you you want an intro to the show or get some warm-up an about Jeopardy or do you want to go right into Epstein the letter from Pam to cash is is crazy dear director Patel before you came into office I requested the full and complete files related to Jeffrey Epstein in response to this request I received approximately 200 pages of documents late yesterday I learned from a source that the FBI field office in New York was in possession of thousands of pages of documents related to the investigation and indictment of Epstein despite my repeated requests the FBI never disclosed the existence of these files when you and I spoke yesterday you were just as surprised as I was to learn this new information by 8:00 a.m. tomorrow February 28th the FBI will deliver the full and complete Epstein files to my office regardless of how such information was obtained there will be no withholding or limitations to my or your access my question to you guys is do you think that this is much to do about nothing then that the FBI needs to have the discretion to be able to say no or do you think this is one of these things where you're not allowed to uh do what they're doing I think it's above my pay grad I don't know the law of like FBI investigations and then what if they investigated a bunch of people they were not guilty and then they were in the files maybe they need to look at them before they do a document on maybe there's informant in there I'm trying to think of what happened with like The Whistleblower papers from um this says something different this doesn't say let's negotiate what we should release together so that we protect people this says we're just gonna lie to we're gonna lie to you and tell you that you know here's here's that's her side to the story maybe they have another side maybe the FBI has a different side we have to hear from them right is this just like people are intrigued by the gossip angle of it or is it because they want to prosecute people for hurting people or is it because they want to cancel people and this is a nice opportunity to cancel like what's what's what's the I think's happen interesting question because this thing's been going on for 20 years I think this actually has more to do with conspiracy there is and now the Deep state like is there a deep State cover up is the question I think the question is if the chain of command requests something are you allowed to withhold it because you decide in your own judgment that the person above you doesn't deserve to know it I think that's an important question yeah the thing about the FBI is the FBI can withhold information from the president from other folks if there's an ongoing investigation sources are like secret and they would be Jeopardy and National Security concerns I'm I'm reading here so I'm very excited to see these next two days unfold listen it's a breaking news story we'll have more to say about it next week when we get the facts all right it has been an amazing 24 hours for my guy David freedberg I am so proud of you if people don't know David freeberg was on I'm sorry Celebrity Jeopardy this week and he had a great performance Je you can't say that I can't say it you're right bleep it out bleep it out so you were on celebrity quote unquote Jeopardy shows you how much of a bar there is the bar was pretty low they they're now inviting podcasters apparently but Jeopardy's watched by like 10 million people every episode right yeah they have like a huge audience on regular Jeopardy I think it's like 9 million a night or something or seven seven to n million a night yeah but I think Celebrity Jeopardy because it's like later it's got a smaller audience but it's still like couple million people watch this thing which is crazy so you were on and for the last four or five months we've all had to like bite our tongues and you've been in a full scale I don't want to say panic but you've been hand ringing about your performance and spoiler alert freeberg won not only did he win heing crushed it I was like watching this this was like better than watching the World Series of Poker or a Knicks Warriors game for me here is my my favorite M moment the Allin call as a tribute he gets the deli double and I'm going to go Allin Ken oh okay how dare you 12,800 for Dave but you have to be correct in African geography known for its snows this Tanzanian Peak is both Africa's highest and the world's tallest freestanding Mountain what is Mount kilamanjaro that is correct 12, what did you think of that moment Shan he goes all in and these people they think that they're to get freedberg by giving him a question about Africa not knowing that he's african-amer honestly like a six-year-old you guys want to hear something crazy so sixy old should know that category no that so that category African geography I was at dinner the night before with our friend Xander and his wife uhuh and we started talking about their son was taking a quiz on African geography and they started giving me all the questions and we were actually quizzing at dinner the night before on African geography it was like a Slum Dog Millionaire moment and I was like in my head I'm like there's no way that's real that that actually happened we literally were just talking about African geography at dinner the night before and I'm like the judges had to have been listening or something but but you were nervous you talked about being nervous and your techniques our friend Jason but the we actually are lucky enough to play with one serious professional poker player in our game Jason comes to to the game and he coached you a bit what did he what did he what was his advice to you well I was a little wound up because I watched Jeopardy my whole like since I was a kid right I mean I don't watch it regularly but like a couple months ago I was kind of watching the show I kind of reached out and was like Hey you know do you guys know anyone on the show and that's how I got like hooked up so and I'm like wait I'm really going on that's awesome okay and they're like you're going on Celebrity Jeopardy so I watched the Celebrity Jeopardy episodes from last season and and I figured I could get like 60% of the answers but you get there and you don't realize how hard it is to buzz in in time because if you buzz before the light turns on I've heard this over and over how does it work because you bought I understand an actual buzzer to practice with am I am I correct you did this well yeah I bought this cheap buzzer on Amazon the pressive but it didn't do anything so I'm watching the TV at home watching old EP Celebrity Jeopardy episodes from last year and I'm like oh buzz in buzz in but the problem is when you're there you're not allowed to buzz till the light comes on and if you buzz too early you get locked out for a quarter second and that quarter second makes a huge difference so I was actually behind the people I was against most of the show I felt when I was buzzing in I'm like I know the answer and I kept missing I kept missing so I still did okay obviously but wait a second let me ask you a question about that buzzing thing a light goes on when does the light go on when the question is finished or after half show the question on a huge screen so the whole screen gives you the question right away when so you can read ahead so you can read ahead just read the whole thing boom yeah then you have to wait for Ken Jennings to finish as soon as he finishes enunciating the last syllable of the last word the like turns on but here's what I found out there is a delay of about 150 to 200 milliseconds difference between your eyes and your ears you actually hear stuff before you see stuff and which is really interesting like for your brain to register it and people have different different delays but for me I'm like waiting for the light and then I buzz in and it's too late because the people next to me have buzzed in so speed of sound vers but anyway I was a little I was a little wound up going into this I called Jason because I realized there's no upside by the time I show up I'm like I'm gonna look like an absolute idiot for saying some stupid stuff getting answers wrong which of course everyone texts me last night being like how' you miss hoers how'd you miss this all right you since you're bringing up the big Miss Daily Double oh man you get the Daily Double 16,000 crushing crushing crushing their soul not my best category I'll go 4,000 look great even 20,000 if you're right climactic Moments in Sports movies Jimmy Chitwood buries a jumper from the top of the key to win the Hickory Huskers the Indiana State Championship what is Hoops sorry no what am I doing you were right I'm so embarrassed watching it I can't watch dream come on dude I whoer I know I know hoers I mean come on Jean hman he died today and no one sends me a text being like oh I can't believe you got that answer great job everyone just sends the text how did you not get hooers how did you not get cream it's always like oh I knew the answer you're need I realize different and I realize as I'm walking in Jeopardy I'm like you know what there's no upside because what'll happen is everyone will just call you an idiot for the things you miss which is well I mean and let's face it you're the Sultan of science you went to an you worked at Google so there's an expectation you should run these people over you did run them over for you know who you're facing in the semi-final we don't know until all the quarterfinals are over and that'll be in the next couple weeks here when you see a category come up like the hooers one right I think that one was about sports movies right yeah that was uh Sports movies like big so don't you when you see Sports movies in your head catalog probable answers like Rudy and you know Field of Dreams yeah so you had all those ready to go like look I'm not a guy who gets very nervous I don't get like stage fright or like wound up but for Jeopardy it's so weird you're up there and you can't focus or concentrate like you normally can my brain had these like weird brain farts where I'm like I know the answer why isn't it coming out or I buzz in and I said like Beethoven instead of De I'm like why did that come out God for CLA Delon you don't have to I mean dude don't get me started so there we there's weird stuff that happens up there that's really hard to explain and then you're angry about the buzzing you can't buzz in in time and you're on the set of Jeopardy and it's like oh my God I'm actually on the set of Jeopardy it's all real and you're like watching the scores very it's very overwhelming there an audience yes there is an audience yeah like a 100 people there about 100 people yeah yeah W that's nice yeah before you go on the the show they have you do a practice round in front of the audience just so you get everyone gets used to it and I deliberately answered wrong and I was like acting like an idiot and acting like I couldn't buzz and acting like I didn't know theed I tried to be like he I tried to be a little so diabolical yeah I don't really know what I'm doing here sharp elbows yeah and then I Came Out Swinging and I felt like I had to kind of get aggressive out the gate and you yeah I've done that before in a bar fight once I was like guys guys we don't need to get in a fight and then like bang I just clocked the G anyway we're so proud of you you won you trounced them I have to say the for the Humane Society United States all the money went to charity Humane s of the US how much did you make for them in the end if you win the whole tournament it's a million dollars and thenot of do food as the winner your charity gets more and the losers their charity gets less but it's a fixed amount it's like 30,000 or 50,000 or something like that nice I think they should put the three of us on together normal episode that would be crazy oh my God I would wreck three of us were on I would wreck your ass no you would not I will play you heads up Jeopardy anytime for money let's play I say we play poker we'll play for all of the Allin profits I'll give you two retards twox the chip stack and let's see what happens oh my God and that sounds so compelling would you do it actually J would you do that would you do it all the profits all the profits I do it for all the profits but I would carve out 25% of the profits for a four-way tournament that was televised live if we could get 2 million in sponsors then we'd be up no matter what grift endless not grifting I'm thinking like a business the whole point is no I want to do this so that I inflict pain on one of you or both what gives Chim happiness is hurting others that's we that's his love language his love language hurting the people he loves love language is hurting the people who love him I like putting you two to the test and I like to see you two break okay this what makes him feel good anyways did you guys see Brett atc's tweet no what did you say friend of the Pod Brett atock who's a CEO and founder of figure he just announced today that he's moved his timelines up by two years he's going to Beta Testing robots in the home by by the middle to end of this year that's crazy crazy crazy I mean are you an investor in his company I don't talk about my investments but in this casos here but in this case no I'm not an investor so we're not talking a book here I do think Optimus and this figure and the other this about a dozen of these doing it credibly if they can make these for what shamama 20 grand when do you think it becomes something a middle class household you know dual income household would buy one of these five years from now 10 years from now how how could they be well I think the issue is bounded by two things one is that I'm not sure that the generalized AI is good enough yet and what he did was he had a deal with open AI which he pretty publicly cancelled a few weeks ago m and he announced his own model and I don't know the details of it to know whether he rolled it himself or this is just like taking some open source based model and iterating from it but I think the model is not perfect yet to be general purpose that's one and then the second is a practical issue with the robots which is that the actuators themselves are good but they're not great and you can see it in in the demo where it's an incredible demo because it shows the value and the power of the model where there's sort of this Master Slave orientation that has to happen where one model is actually doing most of the computation and the second model and the second robot is in feeding off of it and the demo that they do Nick you can probably find the video is of them sorting a bag of groceries for the first time totally unsupervised which and it's it's an incredibly cool demo it's a cool demo the thing that that you notice though is that the actuators are good they're not great and so the physical dexterity is still relatively limited and I think that that doesn't allow these robots to be super functional in the next couple of years but when they get that figured out then I think it could be really useful because if you have a robot like this that could sort the groceries make food do the laundry mow the lawn so to speak it just requires a level of dexterity that's not yet totally possible but see in this example what you're seeing are the two robots basically figuring out how to communicate semantically between the robots and that's incredibly powerful and it's yet another sort of breakthrough that we need so I don't know we're probably like a couple years away but see look at the dexterity there he's taking the pepp farms and feels like he's crushing the pepp Farms or she or whatever you call this robot they then please don't misgender the robot but it's it's really incredible they're figuring the the coolest part of this demo by the way which I loved was they take an apple and then the second robot figures out that it should go in the fruit bow pushes the fruit bow to the first robot and then the first robot that's cool there it is but that level of semantic awareness and understanding between two models working dependently is very cool look at that that's very cool they're collaborating with each other makes total sense I can tell you here on the ranch I would love to have an allpurpose robot going out there and using the weed whacker and and trimming the the the the bushes and the hedges and getting me wood and collecting chicken eggs like there's a million things they could do on a ranch it be immediately applicable for ranch work and if they're 24 hours a day it doesn't matter if they go slow but I I think this is the category people are sleeping on and I I don't know who on the on our prediction show said this will be the year of robots but it's been this is the year of robots for 30 years in the industry and it does feel like this is it freeberg you're sticking with your prediction I assume yeah I am yeah I think it's also it's not just this kind of dexterous automation but but I do think drones autonomous vehicles I put them all in the same category where there there's some it's some combination of mechanical response to a machine Vision system that uh I think has become like accelerated this year you need a lot of rare Earths to make robots yeah where could we ever get those from H does anybody owe us a little money is anybody behind on their payments maybe The Vig could be a little you know taste I don't know if you guys have seen this but there was a company in the 90s that was all the rage called segue they were going to absolutely change cities and everything and they never did but it was basically like a scooter you could walk on and had a a balancing uh kind of system to it but they made robots and here they're making these lawnmowers now and these lawnmowers are really like cheap they're a th000 bucks and they work here in Austin I have seen two or three of these on people's Lawns this could be like you know what was the one that you did in your house Roomba so your point freeberg there will be Purpose Driven ones to deliver you a burrito do your lawn Etc and a room is like three or 400 bucks I think and this thing's a th000 bucks man this is going to get crazy I do think it's it's a lot harder to create one of these general purpose systems in automation then create like vertically or kind of utility specific automation system so a device that just does one thing delivers something to you in the air or drives your food to you or loads and unloads your dishes you know I'm not sure if that's the whole the whole idea of the humanoid is it's ambitious yeah it is a general purpose device and it makes a a technically very hard road map I got to imagine some of the bulldozers out there are also now becoming remote controlled so you can get like a a bulldozzer that you have to put in a dangerous situation and their remote control and they're going to have ai so I got pitched on a startup one time that was to go up into Tahoe Hills and allow humans with remote controls to drive Jam off little bulldozers and make fire pths so imagine some fire breaks out you send in or helicopter in the bulldozzer no human in it just got a 5G connection or a starlane connection and Zip Zip Zip you're doing fire roads in the middle of the smoke dense area it's going to be really interesting when these things uh get dialed in and they're getting every day I'm going to ask Brett to be a ba Alpha tester of one of these robots in my house and then we'll go and do we'll do a segment that would be great excuse me robot can I get some more morels toot sweet morels let's talk about stripe I thought the the report was really good we had the cison brothers on last week they crushed it great job to them and then um here is a quick summary so uh in terms of processing volume Aden 1.34 trillion stripe at 1.4 trillion I mean that's incredible that they're both in the almost the same exact space one's growing 33% strip going 38% valuation Aden 56 they're public stripe private 91.5 billion I guess that's the private Market premium employee account very interesting here since we've been talking about uh Jamie Diamond's uh rant last week Aden 4.3 th000 stripe over 8,000 and uh both are profitable aden's got a billy in iida which is extraordinary but stripe has a higher margin what's your take on aala Two Cities here I thought there was three takeaways the first takeaway for me was the value of Stripes ecosystem is is probably underappreciated I think Patrick mentioned it but he just kind of said it as a passing fact and none of us picked up on it but in the report they talk about all the additional products that they're able to build around core payments and one of them is the billing product it's half a billion dollars a year of ARR that's just incredible and I think if they figure out Network effects inside of the stripe ecosystem that's interesting so that's first which is The Hubb and spoke of of payments being at the center been all of these other incremental Services I think that that's really interesting and underappreciated for stripe that probably speaks to why there's such a difference in valuation because aen has less of that ecosystem or at least it's not nearly as well described maybe as Stripes is that's number one second is I go back to what I've been saying for a while now but the the rise of these stable coins is really interesting the stable coin infrastructure globally the push for a bunch of these National governments to embrace them inside of India inside of Brazil slowly it's happening inside of the United States so I think that that was really interesting and then the third takeaway Nick I sent you this tweet was just the the nature of the AI ecosystem relative to the rest of SAS and what this is was from Stripes report which showed the time to get to 5 million of annualized Revenue and the average SAS company took 37 months and by 2024 the top 100 AI companies got there in 24 months I mean that's efficiency in the market right I mean that's why we're all looking at AI saying we could see a lot of our economic issues come from growth and the growth is very clear you can do more with less and you can generate more Revenue with AI so it's it's pretty clear the trend yeah jaman I think it's really clear I mean I can give you a little factoid from 8090 you know we got to 5 million of Revenue in three months really crazy couple of WS in there yeah couple of big ones yeah and so it's just a very different selling motion than than I've historically seen where the ROI is just so obvious in terms of the efficiency that it creates and the cost savings you can generate relative to traditional enterprise software it's a more straightforward sale the ROI is clearer the revenue is bigger it happens faster yeah so there's also I don't know if you're seeing it but there's a sense of urgency in the market right now people feel like they have to adopt this new technology fast because there's competition because the gains are so clear because in a slowing economy this is maybe a way to accelerate Revenue I'll be honest with you at least with the our 8090 customers I haven't seen that yet you know we're in I don't know eight or nine segments of the economy big segments of the economy it's more still about the frustration that they have with what I would call the software industrial complex there's a big and you you can see it with what's happening to Salesforce and other big companies is that these renewal Cycles are getting harder and harder to justify and so people are willing to take some bets and see if there are different ways in dealing with this problem and I think that's the real opport is if you can find a repeatable pattern to help these companies replace that big software spend that they have yeah that scales really quickly and the only way to do that really is using AI in two ways AI inside the Machinery of what you're using yourself to make the things right so those are things like cursor and whatnot to just fully accelerate and then AI within some very specific product that the customers actually need that also create efficiency so there's two different places but the problem with using it in both of these two different places is in the first one you can manage the errors it's very it's very straightforward at the end of the day code either compiles or it doesn't so even if you're using something like cursor which is an incredible product there are no errors at the end of it because the thing actually works or it doesn't the problem is actually when you use these models in actual work and if you're in a regulated environment particularly it gets very complicated because if you generate a hallucination in a healthare business and it causes a you know patient record to be incorrect there are huge consequences there and that we haven't solved yet that exists in regulated Finance it exists when you're dealing with real estate and construction it exists when you're dealing with power it exists in Aerospace right imagine if an llm helps you design a plane better but if there's a tolerance error and that's not well understood that could have you know horrific consequences Downstream so we we're we're working with all these people to try to figure it out it's a very difficult technical challenge but I just thought the stripe data was really interesting because it validates what we're seeing which is the the growth in this industry is it's not like anything I've ever seen before back to the stable coins here's a look at tether they're at43 billion in tethers out there who knows what's reality there they've got a little bit of a shaky history and then usdc Jeremy oair is at 56 billion already and that's only been in existence since like uh really an Earnest like 2021 I do think strip's main business could be for sitting here in five years jamath could be sitting on $300 billion and getting whatever it is 3 four 5% on some coupon right they could be making 1020 billion in pure profit if they uh have a stable coin out there that gets widely adopted yeah and and I and I think the best way for stripe to actually do this is just to to build it and to actually facilitate payments between existing stripe customers because again it's sort of what I said last week these are all ultimately Ledger entries and I think that the more that you can commoditize these things to be a simple Ledger entry inside of two systems of record at two companies that's a much better product feature I think stripe has the scale to do that now and to your point they could have an enormous stable coin business at the same time they're probably better off just embracing what's already been built it may be disruptive to try to launch yet another one I don't know they bought that other company so I got to think they'll launch their own but bridge is the facilitation layer it's the rails yeah but I mean I think you know this is where brand comes in if you have a trusted brand amongst developers and uh there's three choices are they going to take tether which people go H maybe it's a little sorted it's offshore I got some challenges there am I going to use USD see okay I haven't heard of it but okay yeah they sound interesting oh I'm going to use stripe I'm going to go right to stripe it's kind of like the IBM you know or Microsoft of payments nobody gets fired for picking shrip I would say so not anymore not anymore right let's go through the market update here a lot of people are trying to figure out are we going to have a market collapse a boom let's just look at some of the numbers and have a a first principal discussion here S&P up almost 2% so far this year NASDAQ 100 flat Dow up 3% so pretty good start to the year in those index numbers but if you look at the max 7 some of them have some had some serious compression Tesla down 27% I do think that they had a big Trump Elon Spike Google down 10% Amazon 9 Microsoft about 8% meta Apple Nvidia were up to varying degrees and then coming into our taping this week Bitcoin down 15% over last month that too got the Trump bump and then adding to all this confusion unemployment is still at historic lows we're at close to 4% and if you look at the deportations that were promised they've been modest to start obviously they're just getting started they need some money to deport folks but they've only been deporting 500 people to a th000 a day and we haven't heard many numbers about the last couple of weeks as Doge has been sort of the center of attention so you know they'd have to get to two or 3 th000 people a day to have low Millions let's say Cham two or three million people deported for it to have any impact on unemployment finally act three and then we'll we'll get everybody's feedback on this CPI up 3% year-over-year we had di down to that nice 2% handle and uh now it's back a little bit if you remember in September it bottomed out around 2.4% just in time for the election interesting how that happened that same month the FED cut 50 bips then it cut another 25 in December and since inflation's been growing modestly but steadily not insignificantly so put it all together trth and what do you think and then freeberg will go to you I tend to be sort of in the Stevie Cohen Camp it's not like the bottom is going to fall up but there's like a lot of room for concern I guess is the best way to put it um Nick I don't know if you can find that clip that at fi but he had a very precise summary of how he saw the world and I I I frankly just agreed with everything that he was saying so he he probably can say say better than I when you take a brew of tariffs on top of that we have slowing immigration and in addition now you have Doge I mean that's austerity we think growth is going to slow to 1 and a half% from 2 and a half% in the second half and so I'm actually pretty negative for the first time in a while and it may only last a year or so but it's definitely I think the best gains have been had and and wouldn't surprise me to see a significant correction I think a couple of very specific thoughts the first is that you're starting to see this compression of the mag 7 towards everybody else so this is the forward PE of these guys and so what you're starting to see is everybody else starting to capture back some of the ground people are processing what the real upside of of the mag 7 is now if you go to the other chart what this starts to show you though is that MA 7 is really priced to Perfection and so you have to believe that the world kind of stays the way that it is otherwise you're going to have some amount of of mean reversion so I think the stock market on the margin is a little expensive and not particularly that attractive second the bond market has basically said okay we are going to give you credit that doge is going to work and that tariffs are going to work so we've had some pretty meaningful compression in the 10e which I think is really interesting I think it's very good for Bess and and for Trump and I think I've mentioned this before but we got to go in and you know refinance 10 trillion in the next six months so you could see this thing maybe even get under 4% if we gets a good string of data the real problem I think though is that if you look back and say what does this look like the example that I would give you guys is in 2010 in the United Kingdom the deficit as a percentage of GDP was 10% and the UK government embarked on a multi-year austerity plan and they said we're going to get the deficit as a percentage of GDP back in line and ultimately by 2016 it got to 3% which is where we are trying to get to and right now we're a little bit under 7% we're trying to get it to 3% so it's interesting to ask what happened and there the bond market gave the UK government a ton of credit so they kept rates relatively low and they brought them back from where they were that seems like What's Happening Here Yeah the stock market the stock market kind of went sideways to a little bit down let's see what happens here but the real big thing is in the UK all of this created tremendous dissatisfaction and you had brexit so I think the question that I have is is if we go through a prolonged austerity program and the frustration amongst the American populace builds what's the release valve there the release valve was Voting to leave the EU here it's not quite it's not obvious to me what a release electing Trump was step one and I don't know if there's something even more populist than Trump other than I I think he is the mechanism of implementing the austerity I think people want this austerity just the question is what happens when the actual byproducts of that austerity are felt by people for six or seven years I don't know what the answer is certainly people are in favor of Doge and downs serving the government more than I think anybody anticipated people are the statistics are showing and the polls are showing freeberg that it's incredibly popular when you look at this I don't want to say conflicting but it's a lot of different conflicting data here as to what's going on what do you what are you you see in the numbers here and what does your instinct tell you because part of this I think is getting used to Trump again right like he says a lot of stuff some of them are scary some of them are just trolling and everything in between so what are your thoughts here or Market's just adjusting to the the new uh the new team back in town the big question in the Trump actions is around tariffs versus the tax cuts that are being proposed versus the the spending cuts those are kind of of the three levers and there's a very serious sensitivity to the economic outlook for growth and inflation as a function of how far each of those three levers are pulled and how they relate to each other is Trump actually going to pull forward the cuts that he has talked about or that elon's talked about how real is that there's a whole spectrum of opinions on that right now on one end you're looking at the house and the Senate reconciliation process for the budget proposal that they've put forth and you're going to scratch your head and be like are we really cutting enough relative to what the economists and others are telling us we need to do meanwhile you've got Elon and Trump saying hey we're cutting we're cutting we're saving we're going to get to a trillion dollars a year but that's not showing up necessarily in the budget is it showing up in the actions out of Doge TBD so there's a whole spectrum of opinions on the cuts on the Tariff side there's a spectrum of like how far are these tariffs going to go you know the United States up until 18 something was entirely tariff driven in our federal government's revenue and it was a way of being kind of protection to the industry here and then over time the tariffs rates came down and down and down as we introduced an income tax which started I think at 3% right after the Civil War and went to 5% for high income earners and then obviously in the 20th century that's totally flipped now we have like no tariffs and a 50% income tax for the highest bracket so can we actually revert back to a tariff driven an income model for the federal government and what is the economic effect on growth for Corporate America in that world where taxes get cut for the companies and for individuals but we make all of our money from global trade does this the The increased cost of global trade hurt companies more than the benefit of paying fewer taxes lower taxes that's the big economic argument that's underway right now and it's funny it kind of seems to fall along political lines believe it or not much like everything else you know like economists that uh that are democratic aligned are Dem my party doing uh I agree with that yeah yeah exactly and so the Democrat align economists will say the tariffs don't make sense they reduce uh economic growth they have a negative effect we shouldn't be doing that and then the Republican Allied economists are saying the tax cuts will more than make up for the reduce the reduction from the tariffs and that's the big unknown right now um so I would say that the spending cuts wide spectrum the income tax cuts big Spectrum on what's actually going to get done here and then the tear Up's big Spectrum on how far this is going to go and so those three things you've got like three very wide ranges of things that all interplay that ultimately determine inflation economic growth government deficits over the next decade and we don't really have a clear picture yet of how those three things interplay and they're all being hotly debated and by the way there's High variability they're changing dayto day every day Trump's like this tariff that tariff yesterday there's a whole bunch of confusion on tariffs today there's a whole bunch of like discussion on how far the tax cut extension is going to go in the reconciliation process and on and on and on so TBD I encourage people to use my 72-hour Rule and look at what happens 72 hours after Trump says something spicy because a lot of times he's just he says a lot of things and not just Trump like yeah but the house and the Senate they both put forward their their budgets right now they go through this reconciliation process and there's a lot in there that leaves a lot to be desired if you're if you're a an absolute like you know fiscal conservative and you're trying to get us to 3% deficit as a percent of GDP you're like wait a second does this do enough and the tax cuts are 4.5 trillion over 10 years so you know it's approximately 450 billion a year if you're trying to catch up how are we doing tax cuts but Jal remember you can't make those statements as fact because a lot of those over 10year projections are projections based on someone's estimate of the economic effect of the tax cuts so there's also a lot of debate on that which is hey some people are saying if we make these tax cuts the economy will grow faster than this particular the CBO economists will estimate the CBO economists are trying to be conservative so there's a whole lot of debate going on right now on like how much is this really going to cost and people like oh my God Trump is talking about raising our deficit so much over the next decade but then there's a different point of view which is wait a second if you assume that the economy will grow because of these Cuts then that's actually not true and then there's all these wild cards around the golden Visa card yeah we're about to get to that yeah are the tariffs going to be a trillion a year are they going to be2 trillion dollars of Revenue or no knows it's just a negotiating position just a negoti so no one knows yeah no one knows so that that's my I think main point is this uh this Administration is all over the place you know and the cuts are great but's right the B market tells you a lot the fact that the has the 10 year was was peaked at 5% two two weeks before the election and then it peaked again the second week of January at 4.78% now it's down to 4.26% today so it's come down by a full half a point in the last month which tells you a lot about the expectations on inflation and growth over the next decade and it's actually a reasonable like sign that we don't think there's going to be rampant inflation over the next decade based on some of the policy decisions and actions that are being taken by this Administration so I would say there's some indication that if if you were to kind of try and decode the Enigma of the three things that we talked about are going on you know it's generally kind of deflationary to some extent or it's not inflation are you optimistic just net net Dave you optimistic about this next foure period or not I'm honestly pretty uncertain and I'm pretty unhappy with both um the Senate and the house budgets personally I don't think fat too many Cuts I don't think there's enough action in there I don't think that and it's weird because you hear Elon talking to all the members of the the cabinet and he's pretty clear-cut hey we've got to save this government is in a debt spiral we have to fix this problem Yad yada and then it's sort of like business as usual which like I said when we were in DC that was exactly my observation for every Senator representative member of Congress that we met with or that I talked to at a cocktail party it was the same it was like I got to get this for my people that's the goal and we've turned this Federated Republic into a whole bunch of elected representatives showing up in DC scrambling and grabbing money for their constituents that's what they were hired and elected to do and it's a really unfortunate circumstance that no one looks out for the better interest of the US dollar over time and says you know what we've actually got a limitation on us and that limitation should be less than 3% deficit to GDP that's our budget that's our Max budget and start from there and then do a buildup yeah yeah I mean chamath I think Collective action aside you've been talking a little bit about this I don't know if it was a couple weeks ago you were tweeting about the great reset Theory and there's you know whatever that is the third or fourth turning people have been talking about you want to uh maybe encapsulate your thoughts I think you have to figure out what the goal is so one goal is you could say that the Republicans want to have consistent political power right that's a reasonable goal the Democrats want that too right a different goal would be to do what freedberg said we're going to go and take the lumps because we are going to defend the dollar and The credibility of the United States we're just going to make sure that structurally it's sound and take the pain that's necessary to reset that could be a goal I think the reality is something in the Middle where you can't be in one camp and you can't be in the other because I don't think you can get anything done and somewhere in the middle I think the thing that I have been thinking a lot about is when will somebody sniff out what the great Coalition is that preserves political power whether that's the Democrats or the Republicans the reality is that you will have a consistent majority if you get three cohorts of people together cohort number one are the people that frankly don't have many assets and are the working in Middle Class meaning they don't necessarily own homes they don't necessarily have investments in the stock market so they don't particularly care about what's happening there okay that cohort dominates there was a clip of a discussion at Harvard just this past week about the different political coalitions that voted for Trump versus kamla Harris the most important takeaway that I took from it is that if you make $100,000 or more a year you're a reliable Democratic voter if you went to college you're a reliable Democratic voter everything else is a reliable Republican voter but the thing to remember is that bucket of everything else is growing faster than that first bucket so you have this Coalition of the asset light working in middle class and then you have other people patriotic business people and patriotic business owners and Technology people that care about Innovation that Maga has been able to into a coalition my point is if that is the consistent reliable thing that cements political power multiple elections from now and we've seen this before in the past where Republicans can go on a three-term run or you know a four-term run Democrats have as well in the past it is bad news for the stock market and it is bad news for asset owners because it doesn't reward the constituents back to Freed Brook's point so if you are going to feed your constituents and your constituents don't own stocks and your constituents don't own homes or they are so wealthy that they can be inoculated from a massive draw down in those asset categories what do you think the winning strategy is that is my rough working version of what our version of brexit is right so if you have many many years of austerity what does it really result in I think if you want to cement political power I think it requires a walking down of these asset markets in a meaningful way that's stocks and that's real estate and I just don't see any other way around it fascinating the good news is I think from my perspective is but by the way sorry last thing I would say that's a total Theory and I could change my mind as I get more data but I'm just saying like I'm just trying to work through the possibilities and in the distribution of outcomes that's sort of where my heads at right now I think it's like a good mental model because politicians want to stay in power how do they stay power the populace has to want to continue to back and they have to understand what backing strategies that that reward asset owners when asset owners are a shrinking minority is not a good idea well there's 60% of the country own assets but 80% of those assets are in the top like 10% so it is definitely weighted heavily people do have some I guess through their 401ks in some cases and yeah 60% of people own a home 61% but yeah I think it's a it's a good framework the good news is if you look at every time we have a great technological Revolution whether it was the iPhone or the internet now ai that tends to make uh the most impact on the economy and So based on what I'm seeing on the streets entrepreneurship is on fire right now no but that's not true I think you're confusing that with how certain people like everybody has an iPhone that's true but you're the one that's talked a lot about this a lot it hasn't lived lifted average hourly earnings that much in fact we've had massive wage suppression it has rewarded the employees and the stockholders of Apple or Google or meta but that's not everybody well I'm talking more about yes you're correct it does polarize the win in apple shareholders right in the case of the iPhone or Google in the case of the internet but it does make the entire populace more efficient and the United States more efficient since we LED both of those revolutions I I don't I think it does I think it it benefits supremely a small cohort of people that's why the the denominator goes up but does it affect individual people in measurable ways on a broad-based basis I think that's been statistically proven is not to be true that's why we have the populism we have today it's disproportionately rewarded equi holders that's obvious and wage earners it you know have not had the same escalation but I'm talking about the United States and our place in world and our economy when compared to other countries so I still think if we lead AI we will still have the best standard of living the best overall economy in the world but I love his what do you guys think about the golden Visa I love that golden Vis well this is incredible because I literally tweeted like six months ago you know we should just sell citizenship for $500,000 a pop and he added a zero I'll give you prediction I'll give you a prediction I will predict that within the next few months after this gets announced you are going to hear about Founders taking $5 million of secondary in a round M to make sure that if they are non-americans to get their visas 100% hey uh check out this prediction Nick we now have a poly Market to trade how many gold cards Will trump sell in 2025 poly Market ohk well done I I think what is the what is the bet well so you either can have zero okay you can have one to 100 100 to a th000 here's the the different levels 1, 2500 25 5,000 so you can basically buy the level that you think there's an 8% probability right now in poly Market that by the end of 2025 there will be zero of these golden Visa sold 25% chance of 1 to 100 177% chance of 100 to a th000 and so on the most probable level is actually 2500 to 5,000 which is sitting at 29% probability right now yeah I'm taking the I'm taking the way so what do you think this is by the end of 25 Jal so you got to get they basically have to get the pr they still have to get this done they get the program up and running and then people by the so it's by the end of 25 is the okay so people are really just betting when can he get the first one done and then yeah H how many does he get done yeah I know I'm going to take the top two I think I might take 5,000 and above here will you put real money on that you should do that oh you can't trade it's not available to Americans but if there was a way to do it I might do it this is not uned by the way called the E5 which I talked about on this where noncitizens can invest a of money but it's a bit of a scam I got pitched on it people said oh we can get you LPS for your fund here's how it works they invest in some you knowy fugazi real estate thing you have to you have to create 10 full-time jobs is the yeah so there's a bunch of scams going on about this5 but I said as your president I'm going to sell these citizenships and get 100,000 people to do 500k each right and I said would sell like Tes Swift tickets I I got to tell you I think out of the gate Apple meta Microsoft buy you know one to 10,000 of these so let's say you were able to buy these and you could swap them out like if somebody left and went back to their country you could still use it you still have the Visa these would become incredible for recruiting Talent if you got to get the CEO of a company over here and you can offer them that you could buy their company is that how it's going to work or is that is it going to be tied to a person do you think we got two different issues here one is is could you swap these between another person we don't he the president could make it like that if they wanted to for corporations to give them essentially what is a a season pass that you could swap between users those things exist in the world as a concept so he could decide to do that the second piece is how valuable they are are they worth five million or are they worth a million which which would sell the most the way this is proposed by Trump and letnik is it's $5 million for basically a green card you get permanent residents in the United States you get to live here permanently yeah they're getting rid of the E5 program after this that's their proposal and so here's here's the MTH let me ask you guys a question Jamal jakal how many people in the world have a net worth above a 100 million oh above a hundred uh well we know that there are like 5,000 four or 5,000 billionaires is the estimate I think globally so a millionaire well I think that there's a lot there's a lot of hidden billionaires so I would Russia and China even in America I would guess that there's at least 10 or 15,000 billionaires in the world 100 millionaire and so then as a s probably 50,000 that's what I said 28,000 40% of whom are in the US which means there's 17,000 who knows that number is real come on yeah these these numbers are all made up so I I you know how many Russian oligarchs have $100 million a l okay so whatever fudge Factor you want 17,000 is the reported number of 100 millionaires outside the US do you think that that's the cut off for people that would spend five million and then what percent of them would buy a US green card for $5 million oh I think people with 20 million who are overseas in Venezuela or the Middle East would spend 5 million on it if it was a path to them becoming a US citizen you advertise that over a lifetime you could make twice as much money living here so I think the numbers like if you had $20 million you would give 25% of your current net worth to get into the US of course you're going to buy a house here worth 10 million and Donald Trump said that you would not have to pay any tax on foreign assets right right easy peasy it's a True Green Card yeah that is real no no no a real green card is what I had which is your Global income is taxed that's true so it's worse meaning the green card is worse than this this is way better so if if I had to do it again and this was available to me out I'm not sure million bucks I'm not sure there's a million buyers I think there's probably 10,000 Max buyers of this thing is my take the over of 10 I wouldn't take the over of a million I think you're right on the Million number is that what did Trump say he said there's a million Market Nick the most probable is 1 to 2500 I think that's probably right but you didn't ask total you ask in year one and I mean you it takes six months to get anything done this poll is this poll is dumb the real question is how hard will they be vetted because I think the point is there's a lot of gray money around the world so the question is can you bring it into the light right so how many like look I I know of many people in India many who are extremely wealthy in ways that we don't understand and their wealth is literally like in cash it's in Gold how are they supposed to kind of like if they wanted to like raise their family in America because now it's possible how do they do that how do they how do they take their assets do you go to JP Morgan and all of a sudden like you show them this golden visa and they say great we're gonna if there's a workaround to like the kyc AML laws honesty freeberg you could sell two million of these things don't think so if you literally have to go through the existing set of Frameworks on like ofac AML kyc all that stuff it's probably in the tens of all I have to say is this is one of the greatest proposals ever and oh it's great it's fan freaking tastic combined with Doge okay uh if he gets this done if he gets do but I agree with you by the way accredited investing done if he gets those three things done I'm voting for his third term we're going to redo the uh Jason just explain to us your your personal interest in accredited investing what's the grift connection I'm not sure I'm fully tracking it's not a grift connection I feel like there's a bunch of people stealing money doing crypto scams and that all of that would be solved If people could just take a test to become an accredited investor which is like currently six or s% of the country and then they would understand diversification and you know how different devices work convertible debt whatever and if they did understand that you could take people who are gambling in the stock market and allow them to invest in private Market companies and I believe that would create more this issue we brought up in the last segment about poor people not being able to become rich people and upward Mobility upward Mobility could be very easily hold on let me finish my upward Mobility could be so much better if a person who's in Uber driver or an HR person working you know at a company could put $500 $1,000 instead of betting on the Nicks or the Jets God forbid they could put that $500 into this new product or service they're using LinkedIn or this new product service they're using and then that would allow more startups to get created there are so many people who contact me after reading my book and say I want to invest in startups they can't and I think they would be so much better off putting a $100 or $500 into a startup than just wasting it at roulette great I'll take the opposite okay goad and I'll tell you why I think you're right it would be great but they should buy the S&P they should buy the SNP index proven scaled audited profitable well vetted solid fiduciary responsibility with public board companies yep if you learn from the the problem is most of these people most people even smart VCS even intelligent people make extraordinary mistakes in the startups that they back I don't think that we have a shortage of startups I think we have a shortage of good startups and I think but if you if you flood the market with capital you're going to see the same problem we've had with every Venture Capital cycle or every private cycle which is you get a whole bunch of that gets funded that shouldn't get funded that ends up eating a lot of people's money and unfortunately when people are less sophisticated and they enter the private investment markets they're not going to necessarily be left well off they're going to end up getting scammed in a different way someone's going to show some crazy fancy PowerPoint to them take their money and they're gon to get eaten up which won't happen if they buy the S&P go ahead okay yeah so let me counter all that they should buy the S&P sure and they can do that today right they can get a Robin Hood account 11% a year perfect and that's the protectionist paternalistic approach that we've had what that doesn't do is it makes them nice and safe and then their $1,000 becomes 1,70 next year and $150 the next year great they learned one lesson the rule of 72 in compounding interest that's the only lesson they learn but when you start betting on startups you learn how entrepreneurship Works how product Market fit works and so sure put 80% into index fund and put 20% into investing in private companies they would learn more and when Uber wanted to give Uber drivers access to buying shares they're not allowed to and so the rich can buy whatever they want they can make whatever bets they want they can be a private Equity they can be in all these things that have the chance to 100x to 10x but poor people can't all I'm saying is if they're educated and they take a course let them do take a little bit of risk in an intelligent fashion and let them learn about entrepreneurship I grew up blue collar and I didn't have exposure to how private for company formation worked I didn't understand any of this I had to battle my way to learn all of it if you had a course and people could go just as easily as they go to prize picks which I bet on every Knicks game and they could go just as easily to prize picks as they could go to coinbase as they could go to a private Market company invest that would be better for Upward Mobility so you're right people are going to lose money but they're going to learn what do you think Jam settle the difference between the two of us I think that both are true I think that we're all much better off just owning indices or at least that was true I think the the problem with these indices right now is those are not really well balanced indices because the rules have changed and the rules have changed because these companies have been smart enough to Lobby folks like S&P and S&P has allowed these thresholds to creep up and so now when you're buying the S&P 5 00 you're not doing that anymore you're buying the S&P 7 and then the rest in the 493 is you know 60% so if that's what you want that's fine so we'd have to fix the ETF Market to make sure that there was a little bit more transparency and there was more balance but these weighted indices are basically just the mag s that that's neither good nor bad I'm just saying that's what it is and so yeah and I'm just saying it just creates the same problem people think they're buying diversification because you're like hey go here and it's diversifi ands out not not not even diversification just like vetted like mature real companies versus what I think will happen which we've seen time and again with people that are not sophisticated or experienced when they first enter a new a new market any Market is this process of adverse selection which is you have predatory practices predatory pitches that show up and say invest in this it's a great deal this is the new thing most people aren't able to vet that thing and they end up getting taken advantage of and that's the problem they're getting taken advantage of it every crypto thing right now so all I'm arguing for is more education and a path for those people who want to do it to show 5 hours of Education 50 questions that they have an above average you know knowledge of how private companies work just so they have the choice to do that I think the balance that PE we will have to strike is there are a lot of people that are on the outside looking in with no assets and then second there are a lot of young people who want the high alpha opportunities yes like crypto represent and so free it's easy for you to pull the ladder up from under you because you're already rich but for people that are not rich and if you went back to when you were poor the question is how would you have reacted if somebody above you basically said I'm going to tell you what you can invest in and would you have said okay that seems reasonable I know you're looking out for me I that's question don't disagree with that I think there's a reason we have Securities regulations and securities laws that public companies have to follow but private compan are more LAX on that's that's where there's this distinction so I don't disagree that's not that's not what I'm saying I'm saying when now that you're rich you want rules for everybody else what I'm saying true don't don't don't mischaracterize me chamad that's not true at all I'm obviously a free market guy I don't give a poor people invest in I'm not I'm pointing out the consequence of what would happen I'm not saying I disagree with the notion to telling you what I think is gonna happen Okay what I'm asking you is go back to when you were poor how would you react I would want to invest in everything I'm not disagreeing with the notion I'm pointing out what will happen which is predatory ass will show up and they'll rip people off that's what happens in everyone of and if you're educated that's why the education component hits here you'll learn something just like people are learning right now to not bet on the jets ever what do you think the solution is people can lose their ass they just need to know they're going to lose their ass I'm just telling you that's what's going to happen and then you know what's going to happen next Elizabeth Warren's going to get on TV and be like hey we got to fix this put a bunch of no cares what poah has to say that's how this goes I'm pointing out this is what happens markets yeah I agree with you that is the cycle but what I'm saying is how do we fix it then how do you allow people that don't have assets to have assets that work for them how do we how do we do even as as you guys know we looked at the data even the best Venture Capital firms in Silicon Valley with the smartest most sophisticated people investing in private assets were not able to beat the NASDAQ over years get that's true what I'm saying is what you were saying before this is I'm confused what you were saying before is people should only be allowed to invest in the I didn't say that that is what you said that's not what ICT what you said that is what you said that is exactly what you said I said here's what's going to happen I said here's the consequence predicting Doom got it yeah here's the other possibility of what happens eBay Etsy Airbnb door Dash say to the people who are part of their networks for every hundred rides you do we're going to give you $100 in shares for every hundred night you book we're going to give you ,000 in shares of Airbnb and by the way you can buy extra shares if you want to and the government says you can spend up to 20% of your yearly income average for the past few years on investing in startups and then some number of people who built those networks whether it was Google's Network or eBay's Network or Ubers or door dashes or were part of Tesla some number of those people are going to hit massive home runs and they're going to move from the bottom third to the middle third and then number of those people are going to say you know what I got really educated I looked and I understood Tesla and I understood Uber so now I'm going to bet on this AI self-driving company and I'm going to bet on this other company that makes robots and delivers you know vetos and the entire group of people in our United States is going to get more Savvy about entrepreneurship and capital allocation that's a good thing I think what's going to happen is not much of anything I think the rules are going to stay exactly where they are in favor of the top 10% because I think this argument between the two of you is exactly the reason why it can never change and I think that that now again so then what is the alternative maybe it comes back to what I said before which is then the only alternative left is just to debase assets and then if you debase assets and make them much cheaper then there's less money theoretically to lose per Quantum of investment so maybe that's that's the right way to think about it we got to get more people owning equities in this country that's just high order bit because if you feel like you have more agency in your life and you're just smarter and savier that's the American dream and we've lost the American dream to your point in the earli segment month half the country doesn't feel like they can ever get into the top half they don't feel like they'll ever be able to buy a second home or even a first so you have this helplessness of one group of people who are like I need a handout and the other group of people are like got any stock tips where are you making money what can I place a bet on we're sitting here at a rigged game we all get to play in one casino and then everybody else gets to work in the casino I just want the people work in the casino to be able to place some bets and maybe become owners in businesses hey you know I I think talking about the US Postal Service is interesting it turns out Trump is going to issue an executive order to dissolve the leadership of USPS and the postal service is going postal about this in some ways uh not literally but they're angry about it and they want to observe the absorb the agency into the executive branch uh just so you know post office has been operating for 250 years Trump plans to fire the governing board and place the agency under the control of Commerce lutnick Commerce and for contacts US Postal Services lost $10 billion last year on 80 billion in Revenue they can't figure out how to just make a simple profit margin or even break even and IT employs 635,000 workers by the way Howard did an interview with Fox News yesterday where he said one of the ideas that he went back to the president with was for the postal service to the census which would save 4 billion a year give him another idea which is I think that non-farm payrolls and GDP that data should be collected by USPS as well because they touch every business you can actually get instead of sampling with all this error and all of this craziness that we have there has to be a way for then all of these feet on the street to get us much more accurate information so that the markets can actually function properly I am surprised that we don't see even more dramatic revisions and that probably again is like errors on top of Errors I really don't trust like you know you showed the GDP data or you showed the unemployment rate Jason no we all know this stuff is crazy it's wrong I just don't know how wrong it is yeah and this is where Stripes data might come in handy uh I I did a tweet about this and it's one of the most popular tweets or controversial I got three and a half million views here without an Elon retweet or anything I had a very simple concept here Postal Service goes down down to one time a week easy peasy once a week there's nothing coming in the PO US Postal Service that's that important two all citizens starting next year have to opt into getting postal mail by paying $1 a year so you got to sign up for it you got to give them a credit card or something I'm thinking 80% of people don't even bother because it's all flyers and garbage anyway and what people don't know because I was in the magazine business and I knew all about this we had a magazine rate a media rate and all these marketers have they subsidized so this is the ultimate marketing and Publishing grift magazines newspapers anybody uh Publications advertisers catalogs they pay nothing and I think they should just double or triple the rate or remove any discounts uh and then take all those buildings chth put them into the new Sovereign wealth fund redeploy the buildings get some money out of that give every postal work or two-year sance or you know whatever graduate it down full full year Severance half year Severance quarter year severance you retrain them and uh just let the private markets handle this what do you think jamtha my suggestions there was a tweet from this woman who got leak some data uhhuh from one of her friends or colleagues in the government where they broke down I think seven or eight leases and real estate things that were happening inside of I think it was Veterans Affairs maybe the numbers are just astounding yeah half the office bace is not being used the other half is being underutilized it's Bonkers Bonkers they're going to be able to sell 75 percent of the stuff so anyway you know don't blame me here but I think it's like a really good opportunity our guy Jeff Bezos come on the Pod Jeff sit in the uh sax chair one time that'd be fun to have him on he's making some big changes at the Washington Post he's lost a fortune running this thing and um it seems like he's getting engaged and in founder mode dare I say he uh posted to his X account and he emailed everybody that the editorial page is going to be run differently he said uh that while newspapers once had a mandate to publish opinions from the broadest possible Spectrum the internet now mostly covers that he said I'm confident that free markets and personal Liberties are right for America I also believe these viewpoints are underserved in the current market of ideas and news opinion so he's going to focus on those two pillars personal Liberties and free markets this seems awesome and I could get into why it's brilliant on a publication basis but I'm just wondering what your thoughts are with him getting more engaged with the publication that he was incredibly hands off with I was a little surprised that he wrote this I I I think that if you want to write about personal Liberty one of the tenants of personal Liberty is Free Speech but he's effectively said that certain opinions aren't allowed anymore I don't think that that's the solution to the Washington Post so I all I think it does is it polarizes the readership even more I looked yeah inside of Google Trends the overwhelming majority of wapo readers are in obviously Washington DC and then Maryland and Virginia Which are the two surrounding states so I think it's very much a Beltway paper I think he's trying to have a direct influence on the ideas that folks inside the Beltway read and so in as much as he's the owner he's allowed to do it but I wasn't a fan of that idea because I think I think the Elon plan is much better here's a fire hose go at it you have to find the people despite all the conspiracy theories I don't think he suppresses free speech in the least in fact I think it's a literal free-for-all inside of X it is a free-for-all I we got Nazi Diamond pendants coming from Kanye the difficulty in X which I think will be the next set of features that he'll have to figure out is how the curation happens yeah where you're curating I'm curating other people are curating how can then for example like when I go to an account that I like there's no easy way where I can Mass follow a bunch of their the people that they follow as an example right I can't just copy it I can't sort of start with a profile those are all these things that allow you to just take on all kinds of opinions right away and filter from there I think that that is a really useful feature so I don't know I I didn't think that if I was the owner of Washington Post I would have been even more extreme on the Free Speech part I would not have sanctioned speech so it's an interesting point you know newspapers historically always had a point of view they picked as side Fox obviously MSNBC now and cable news picked aside this will make the publication I think by picking a side and saying hey here's what we stand for this is our belief system I think it'll just make it viable in one way and you're right he wants to have a certain influence that's why people buy these things that's why they've historically owned them and uh they have a point of view and the idea that it didn't have a point of view previously was probably a mirage that some people felt there was like some OB objectivity but I I like it I like him being more engaged in it and uh tightening it up all right four the sultant of science cha our sick friend the comedian get well soon we can't wait to have you on it's going to be a hilarious time and for David saaks who's very busy the Rainman in Washington DC saving the world I am the world's greatest moderator and we will see you next time byebye love you [Applause] byebye let your winners ride Rainman David and instead we open Source it to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it love queen [Music] of Besties are my dog Tak [Music] driveway oh man my we should all just get a room and just have one big huge orgy cuz they're all this useless it's like this like sexual tension that they just need to release somehow [Music] we need to get mer [Music] all I'm doing [Music]